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    Posted: 15 March 2011 at 3:44pm
Does anyone else find it strange that you need to pass a course to look after someone elses child (eg be a Porse in-home carer) but supposedly are perfectly able to look after your own without any sort of qualifications? I was thinking about it the other day when I noticed a Porse office that offered training.

Do you think it should be compulsory to sit a course and pass it in order to be a mum? If not, why is it so important to do this to look after other people's children?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CrazyCass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 March 2011 at 3:58pm
Good Point LR!

I guess it could be because with your own kids you can do what you like... yes some are worse than others... but then when you are responsible for a basically strangers child there needs to be 'standard' that is set for them to meet?

No doubt everyone has a different idea of what being a good parent is but you wouldnt want you youngster left with someone that will just plop them down in front of the TV all day....

If only we could make people do a course we wouldn't have the issues the country seems to have with families misstreading their young children

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mothermercury Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 March 2011 at 4:35pm
And you have to get a license to get a dog, but you don't need anything to have kids.

But in all seriousness, imposing restrictions on people's ability to procreate probably imposes on human rights in a pretty big way. Saying "You can't have kids unless you do this course" would be pretty controversial. And what would the punishment be? You're free to do as you choose with your own body, and having kids is one of those things. Unfortunately, some idiots have kids and treat them badly, but I can see how forcing everyone to do a course would probably end up just inconveniencing all the people who would be excellent parents (and MOST people aren't child abusers). To be honest, the people who end up abusing their kids are not the kind who would take part in these courses. Even if it was the law - these people obviously do not care about what the law has to say. I just can't see it working in the way that it would be intended to work.

On the other hand, it is DEFINITELY a good thing to have to do a course to look after others' children. Short of abuse, we can do what we like with our own kids, but we all have such different views on what is "okay" in terms of child-rearing that it is a good idea for people to be trained in "proper" ways to deal with kids.

My 2 cents!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote astral_monkey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 March 2011 at 4:39pm
I'm a firm believer that 'life skills' should be taught at school - including a parenting course. Just an extension of health class really.

There are so many kids out there that are never taught the basics about money, or cooking, or anything like that. And if they don't know it, how are they supposed to teach it to their own kids?

It's a very good point LR! Also, if only we could castrate some people we wouldn't have the issues either, CC.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JadeC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 March 2011 at 4:56pm
Wow, can you imagine the out-cry? Look at the repeal of 59 of the Crimes Act, and the whole "OMG the govt is trying to raise our children!" drama that followed.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote smw85 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 March 2011 at 4:59pm
You do have to wonder about some people though, maybe they need to take a course. Or be disqualified from looking after their own children.

I remember in the news in February about a pregnant woman from Oamaru who avoided jail for animal neglect. She had nine dogs, some who had been locked in a a back shed with no food or water and floor was covered in faeces and urine.   Few of the puppies had died.

The judge didnt send her to jail because she was pregnant but disqualified her from owning a dog for ten years.

So why is she allowed to to look after her own children if she is legally not allowed to look after a dog. Does that not put our countries children at a lower standard of care than dogs?

Personally my opinion is a very hard line. The news stories about children being abused by their own parents disgusts me. Especially when you hear they are having more children!

I believe that once convicted of crimes against your own kids, you should be booked into hospital the next day for tubes tied or given the snip. I wouldn't mind my taxer payers dollars used for that.

Other than that, for parents that the system had obviously highlighted are struggling with children they need to have court ordered parenting courses. Perhaps run by Parents Inc - they are great ive heard!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote smw85 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 March 2011 at 5:02pm
Originally posted by astral_monkey astral_monkey wrote:

I'm a firm believer that 'life skills' should be taught at school - including a parenting course. Just an extension of health class really.

There are so many kids out there that are never taught the basics about money, or cooking, or anything like that. And if they don't know it, how are they supposed to teach it to their own kids?

It's a very good point LR! Also, if only we could castrate some people we wouldn't have the issues either, CC.


Wow, amen to that! I was too scared to say castrate!

I agree, the government should not be raising our children.   They need to protect our children.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rorylex Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 March 2011 at 6:29pm
well actually most people do do courses when they are expecting a child or have a child, antenatal classes followed by baby classes then a range of classes that teach basic parenting skills and are all optional but alot of people are doing them. then playcentre offer courses to help teach you how to effectively interact with yours and others children.

I do think people doing in home care need to be trained as they are being made responsable for other peoples children, and they are being paid to. if i wanted to pay someone to sit my kids infront of a tv i would just hire a babysitter whom i dont expect to have training in anything other than 1st aid.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chickoin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 March 2011 at 6:56pm
I know what you mean, LR, before I had #1 I was kind of freaked out that I was 'allowed' to take this tiny newborn baby home with no previous experience or training and be 100% responsible for her. Just felt strange to me!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote High9 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 March 2011 at 8:33pm
Originally posted by rorylex rorylex wrote:

well actually most people do do courses when they are expecting a child or have a child, antenatal classes followed by baby classes then a range of classes that teach basic parenting skills and are all optional but alot of people are doing them. then playcentre offer courses to help teach you how to effectively interact with yours and others children.

I do think people doing in home care need to be trained as they are being made responsable for other peoples children, and they are being paid to. if i wanted to pay someone to sit my kids infront of a tv i would just hire a babysitter whom i dont expect to have training in anything other than 1st aid.


Agree + lucky for me - being 20 - being a mum came natural to me! but not for everyone I know!

I think it's a bit different looking after someone else's kids tbh and as someone else mentioned we all parent in different ways etc. I guess it just sets a 'standard' sorta thing if that makes sense...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kandk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 March 2011 at 10:51pm
Speaking as a secondary teacher I am fairly sure that any course would be pretty much a waste of time for many people! Teenagers who aren't interested in learning just won't take it in, and in any case a course of say 20 hours hasn't got a chance of overcoming 16 years of bad parenting examples.

There are parenting courses available through Plunket etc, and those who chose to go to them benefit, I'm sure. Those who don't choose to probably aren't willing to learn (wild overgeneralisation maybe sorry!). But it's like compulsory AA or drug rehab - needs the participant to want to be there.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WestiesGirl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 March 2011 at 11:45pm
I find it interesting that you need a licence to drive a car but not to breed!

I agree that it should be taught in school as 'life skills' as a compulsory subject.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote High9 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 March 2011 at 8:34am
Actually that's a fair point - you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink. As we are all raised differently - it affects how we parent and what we see as 'normal' or 'good'/'bad', what 'works' and what doesn't etc.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GuestGuest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 March 2011 at 9:08am
Originally posted by Lil_Nic9 Lil_Nic9 wrote:


Agree + lucky for me - being 20 - being a mum came natural to me! but not for everyone I know!


I think a lot of people feel like this but how do you define "natural"? I'm sure if everyone was given training on childcare and child psychology it would make people think differently about the best techniques for raising a child. I definitely think First Aid should be compulsory at least.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote High9 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 March 2011 at 9:38am
Do agree there, I guess I found most of it to be common sense tbh which I suppose some people lack, sure it's new territory etc but for me personally I didn't find myself asking for advice as I just seemed to 'know' what to do and we haven't had any problems, she's happy and healthy, etc...

I do think First aid should be compulsory, we did have a whole lesson dedicated to it at antenatal but of course not everyone goes etc.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jazzy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 March 2011 at 10:34am
Interesting topic.

When I did child care I trained at teachers college but that was more for teaching that parenting. As a parent I would not leave my child with the "lady down the rd" cause I need a sitter but would look for some where they would be safe & happy & have a standard or care & education I was happy with. I don't need them to be a parent to my child.

I agree with first aid & think every parent/person should have a good understanding. That it should be taught at school/work place & if on a benefit they should run free causes & not just for child first aid /CPR but for all.

I don't think it is up to the school system to teach a child about being a parent or consequences of having unprotected sex it is up to the parents. I will do all I can to teach my boys how to be safe & not have kids young..that they can learn from their dad & not make the mistakes he made.

There are a range of parenting courses you can do & not that expensive & some are free. Millions of books, ways, organisations that can help with BF, sleep, care & what ever you need. So there is help available & a lot of information is given.

I guess as a parent you have your own way of doing things & what you want for your child. All children are different, my 3 have different natures so need different boundaries, discipline & reasoning so can not put them all into to the same "box". I think it is important to raise your children as individuals, nurture & encourage their personalities & let them grow into who they are to be, which is all different.

The parents/people who hurt, murder & comment hanis crimes against children are scum, no parenting course will help them or the child.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote james Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 March 2011 at 10:38am
agree jazzy, and the fact that alot of child abuse crimes seem to be the boyfriend of the mother of the child and any course the mother does propery wouldnt stop her from making a dumb chosse to be with the scum
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jazzy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 March 2011 at 10:43am
Originally posted by james james wrote:

agree jazzy, and the fact that alot of child abuse crimes seem to be the boyfriend of the mother of the child and any course the mother does propery wouldnt stop her from making a dumb chosse to be with the scum


yip & you know what I can not get my head around is how these women can put these men before their child...how can you not protect a child...that is your job as a mum, if you stuff up on everything else that is the one thing you should get right.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mothermercury Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 March 2011 at 10:45am
Originally posted by jazzy jazzy wrote:



The parents/people who hurt, murder & comment hanis crimes against children are scum, no parenting course will help them or the child.


Yeah, this is what I was trying to say.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote astral_monkey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 March 2011 at 10:58am
Child abuse is a separate argument, because, I am sure we would all agree, those people shouldn't be allowed children in the first place.

I agree that it should be the parents responsibility to teach their children the basics of life - the problem is many aren't! And if they're not taught the basics, how are they supposed to teach their children? Thus the cycle continues. The whole point of school is to prepare kids for the real world, adding a course to either teach them what their parents didn't or reiterate what they did, is just an extension of that.

kandk, I have to disagree with you. Your best chance at reaching people is when they are young. Plus even though they act like sullen teenagers, they're still kids and they still want to learn. Most kids will also pick things up even if they are pretending not to pay attention.

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